Excoundrel's 4.1 skin spotlight plus balance changes 🌌


She doesnt have the weakest ealry Game from all heroes (for mages yes though).

She has one if the strongest late game heroes… But require a different play style and its harder than the other mages.

I wasnt angry, its what i wanted.

He is top meta, in fact, quite a few forumers here would argue he is op.

Yeah… Lets kill the only utility hero that needs some sort of skill. I would just revert the last buff, It wasnt needed.

Reminds me a lot from the rose trail of LB BF.

Curious to see what you think about the changes @Sandiha no San Feng changes nor reza.


As @Guest_78 said, he is top tier as top laner along with Grumpjaw


True, I didn’t think about that. I haven’t played 5v5 in about 3 patches bar one match. I almost forget it exists sometimes. That could be the difference.


In my opinion he’s strong, definitely meta, but not OP. He’s probably one of the most balanced heroes in the game, because while his Abilities are strong, they’re all relatively easy to dodge. He may be a bit OP in a well coordinated team, because he does need multiple enemies to chunk him down. Generally I’ve just opted to ignore him until the rest of the enemy team is down though. But again, I’m speaking from a 3v3 point of view. A good nerf might be to give him energy, there’s literally no reason for him not to have any.


I basically agree with all that. Just one thing: VGPRO isnt updated, those stats are from last patch. About celeste, its the same mistake over and over again, every time celeste becomes lo its because the rest were nerfed and she is just left untouched. I would argue about Kinetic being more unfun to play against than yates, but i will say im also surprised he isnt nerfed.
This update shows how bad bot was, where only 2-3 heroes are viable (and op) and the rest are completely useless.
About San Feng, its very hard to see to what point he is strong without having any stats available.
Seriously, what happened with VGPRO?

On Hero Mastery
split this topic #23

9 posts were split to a new topic: On Hero Mastery


SEMC has done almost nothing with the API in almost a year. They’ve not bothered to add data from newer modes, for example, and changes/improvements that were promised over the past 2 years never happened. So I’m sure that Pierre’s interest in maintaining VGPRO has declined. Moreover, he no longer works for SEMC, so there’s that factor as well.


Seriously yates is the most obnoxious hero to play against specially in the laning phase, its like playing against a phinn at level 1 (yes i know he can only hook 1 target and the ability is blocked by minions). If that wasn’t enough he can so easily land an aoe stun, like if a hero has so much ■■■■ cc that is very easy to land why do they feel the need to give him so much damage.


hehehe I love abusing Yates. Do not diss my new main.


Folks, this is a general warning to watch your language here on this forum.


Thats the thing tho, its a acid pool and not really a ROSEtrail


By concept, yates is Broken. Thats the problem. Honestly, ive never liked him.


San Feng is OP and totally not a low tier bully. Seen what t10 silvers/known players can do with him and it’s “too much (to keep my language in check)” to say the least. If he is played from a highly skilled player in high tier match with all the players being good, it’s 90% win for the team he is a part of.


T10 bronze/silvers match from the past with him in my team. One example: chasing 3 players - 2 carries, one captain in a side lane with the base entry tower up. Killing one of the carries while all are on him while retreating. INVADING base to kill half t he HP bar second carry protected by support and then retreat alive. VS competent t10 players. He is not OP, he is broken when played by a good player that knows how that hero works.

Edit: again, this is 5vs5. :smile:


My thoughts:


Baron nerf: Expected

Gwen nerf: Expected

Magnus nerf: Expected

GJ nerf: Expected

Varya nerf: She is honestly still strong, but I never thought she needed to be nerfed. She is honestly fine the way she is. Maybe they wanted to prevent her from being overwhelmong with other mage nerfs? But if that is the case Celeste should also be nerfed lul

Sam nerf: He is really strong in high ranks, so it does not surprise me, but I hope he is not nerfed too hard cause he is pretty balanced if not on the stronger side

Joule nerf: She is still really strong. Not a surprise to me tbh

Lack of a Yeets nerf: This boggles my mind. His A is busted beyond belief especially in high tiers where players actually know when to use his A. That thing has too much range and his movespeed buff on his AOE STUN only makes him even dumber…o and a global teleport…yeah…very overloaded kit…

Lack of a San nerf: I still don’t think giving heroes free damage is ever a good idea. Dude’s a brick wall late game in team fights and with a coordinated team can shut down mid lane. Much better in PC too cause his reactive playstyle is well suited for keyboard unlike say phones where misclicking can be very easy when you need to react so quickly.

Lance potential nerf: Expected changes on Lance. His damage is insane…


Idris: Not doing too much rn, but hopefully he os not buffed too much

Silvernail: Desperately needed a buff

Vox: CP Vox is alright rn. Pretty balanced, but a buff is not farfetched for him

Kinetic: Why

Kensei: Actually surprisingly solid rn. Another buff would actually make him potentially very very strong next patch

Kestrel: Not doing much rn, so not surprising

Patel: Better be a rework

Ringo: Ringo players will appreciate a buff

Rona: Desperately needed a buff, but she might need some kind of overhaul to deal with the CC meta if SEMC is not gonna address CC as a whole

Skye: Appreciates the buff


Seeing Varya nerf and Kinetic buff makes me wonder, do they even play the game? Ringo for once in his life is actually balanced and they decided to buff him. But why though? I hope they didn’t kill Baron and Gwen same as GJ. But usually meta heroes get nuked with nerfs. Joule also didn’t really need a nerf in my opinion. She could be really strong but you can also counter her. If they just nerf all those heroes hard it’s just less viable ones.

Not an expert but I am pretty sure that’s not how balancing works.

Was that Amorph lol?

He’s not at all balanced. I have like 15 games with him and no matter win or loss I only had a bad game once because I built offense without enough defense because I didn’t understand the hero yet. I’ve had multiple games laning against 2 people and even the roam coming and without any help it’s still not hard to win the lane at all. That shouldn’t be a thing. It’s not like that hero requires some godly mechanics.


Dont mind me but I must ask the many of you freaking or atleast already complaining.

We dont know if its a insignificant buff!

Like a buff to Kinetics ult wouldn’t matter as much. So we shouldn’t already bash the patch notes that we havent even saw yet…


Can’t remember rn, but it was few games that I was named a few things, because of a varya pick (not first pick in any of them, to clarify :slight_smile: ). :smiley:

I wonder if there will be also item changes/additions (new items is not likely as no teaser at all) and if this is not the reasoning around some of the buffs/nerfs? :thinking:


For Kinetic you’re right. It wouldn’t change much but either way she does not need it. For Varya though, literally no matter what you nerf it doesn’t make sense. She’s not even close to meta or reliable. It’s not about the buffs/nerfs being too significant. It’s about the fact that SEMC don’t understand what they’re doing. No matter if the nerf doesn’t change anything, if the hero needs a buff nerfing even 1 WP or something is just stupid as it shows how disconnected they are.


I asked because every time I’ve seen someone in his team pick Varya he roasts them hahaha.

I don’t think there will be items or heroes either.