Why Blitz (with talents) is Good

Vainglory Archive Brawl Modes
1

Due to the seemingly majority sentiment from this community that Blitz with talents is P2W at it’s worst or a sweat-fest, or worse than classic blitz, and so on and so forth, I wanted to make a topic in favor of the current blitz mode.

  1. It’s the quickest game mode VG has that has some resemblance of a MOBA.
  2. To be successful, it still requires good teamwork and comps
  3. It’s relatively fair. When MM hits you up with fairly similarly ranked Blitz players, there’s a good chance you have similar level talents for your favorite heroes.
  4. It’s hilarious at times! The super fast pace of play can lead to some ridiculous team fights and funny moments.
  5. It’s creative. I love how some talents can completely change the way in which you’d use a hero. I also love some of the different visual effects talents provide. Two examples: Joule’s rare talent. It greatly increases her mobility with the quicker cooldown for her A. The massive boost to her armor and shield actually makes her a great “captain” and tank in the blitz mode. Throw a fountain, rook, and crucible and she’s got ridiculous armor and shield rating and a huge health boost. Churn’s epic talent makes him a lethal offensive weapon and I love the added smoke effect!
  6. It can still help develop the mechanics and skills that can translate to normal ranked modes. You can still practice good positioning and kiting.

While I did list in another thread my preference for ARAL, ARAM, and Rumble over blitz, I do find blitz to be a really fun mode and sometimes it’s the only way I can play VG on a certain day.

It is certainly frustrating at times when you’re paired with teammates that just view Blitz mode as giving them the license to go into a Rambo mode and rush solo, but I’ve had many games with great teamwork and hard-fought matches.

Overall, I like blitz a lot more than I dislike it and I think talents are perfectly suitable for such a game mode.

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I agree! Not just with this, but the whole post actually. Although especially this. And if I had my wish, the talents would all be tuned like this - changing the way the heroes are played - rather than boosting stats to hyper inflate their existing playstyles.

And this is my absolute favorite, just because it’s so hilarious to see! Especially with the snow monster skin.

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Blitz is the only reason I’m good at Lance

4

They should rename her rare to be “Pogo Stick” or “Joule’s Trampoline”… I always end up saying “boing, boing” as I use it one after the other haha

5

Isn’t all this the same for classic blizt too?

The problem and the reason why some people hate it (including me) isn’t whether or not it’s fair, it’s the fact that it’s P2W, you are forced to play certain heroes to win, and most of the strongest talents aren’t fun to play against. People hate it because of talents like Kestrel’s, kensei’s Epic, Lance’s epic, etc. At the highest levels people doesn’t fight, they just rush objectives.

This is all opinion based so I won’t comment about this.

6

Points 1, 2 and 4 have no correlation with talents, Blitz is a fast paced game mode that requires some teamwork and strategy and its chaotic aspect makes it fun, talents have nothing to do with those points they’re literally the describtion of blitz before there was talents. Point 3 is just wrong, matchmaker matchs players based on their blitz mmr only, you can have very low level talents and still be matched with someone that has maxed out talents. Point 5 is also very wrong, most talents just enhance stats they don’t change the playstyle of the hero, only a very few talents allow for creative plays and they happen to be the talents that are never used cause they’re outclassed by talents that enhance stats. No offense but this post is just bs, its a very weak attempt to defend talents.

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I would love adopt the idea of “Talents in Blitz is a good” but the only thing that holds be back is the idea that not every talent is treated fairly.

The tiers in the talent system is wayyyy to unbalanced for it to be fair. Grumpjaws Rare are miles apart from his Epic and the same applies to the other talents as well.

Seeing the blitz info and stats on Fengs and the newer heros, they are obviously trying to get people to buy them for their op stats or changes but that tilts the scale for the other heros that have actually balanced or weak talents.

Tbh they should just remove tiers in the talent system and make the legendary talents with high scaling with lvls to disperse it across 20 or whatever lvls there are for rares.

I kinda got off topic but

TL:DR is talent system is just way to annoying for blitz to be actual fun.

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I disagree with your comment on point 4. Talents certainly can accelerate the pace of play and the outcome and effects of the game.

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I never said it wasn’t. Unfortunately your post, upon reading it closer, is a classic example of a completely filtered and agenda driven point of view. You don’t like blitz. You don’t like talents. So you read a post to prove that point rather than reading it more open-mindedly. What I said is that you’re likely to play with people of similar talent levels, which from my experience is very true.

I’m not sure how you can follow up this opinion by saying my opinion is total BS lol. But good for you! I disagree. I think talents can absolutely alter the builds and play styles of heroes. We can agree to disagree. No need to say my opinion is BS. Also, a reminder that blitz is low on my list of game mode preferences. This is a bit of a devil’s advocate post. I’m not going way out of my way to defend talents. Just trying to get folks, such as yourself, to be a little more open minded to the game mode.

Unfortunately I think that’s a moot point, lol. Isn’t that the problem with VG as a whole? The same heroes are banned depending on the patch. The same heroes are sought after. If you pick off meta, you’re trolled or a teammate dodges. What I like about talents and blitz is that it makes heroes viable who aren’t in ranked standard play. Kensei is a prime example of that. He is never picked in 3v3 or 5v5 but he’s a solid pick with the right talent levels in blitz.

Listen folks, blitz ranks low on my list. I prefer 5v5, 3v3, and 3 other brawl modes over it. The point of this post is to play a bit of devil’s advocate and get people to be a little more open minded and positive toward the game mode since it’s here to stay. Not saying you have to love it!

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10

I have no talents over level 1 and I constantly get matched with level 20 rare Lyra which 2 shot kills me even though they build AC and SB. That literally drops skill level not increase. It takes away from mechanical skill because they don’t need it to win. Also things like 3 spitfires in no way help your mechanics improve. If you miss the triple spitfire you’re just not even in a fight. Takes no skill at all. Then there’s other things like Lyra’s rare that just give you base stats. There I am tryharding as much as I can with my legendary Idris and then there’s some lvl 20 rare Idris talent guy that has 2 TTs and a TB and outdamages me even though he has less WP on his items combined than me on 1 WP item. Talking before nerfs (?) if there were any, I don’t read talent changes so I don’t know but I don’t see them anymore. Just giving an example though. They build just wrong, it’s terrible build. They don’t stutterstep and/or use abilities and they still get triple kills just because they passively have 20% attack speed, damage and what not. As Sandiha said maybe before talents you could practice your mechanics in blitz but not now. You play blitz only if you want to hurt yourself (talking talentless/level 1 talents).

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This I totally get and agree with. I’m not denying that a large difference in talent levels can dramatically impact the mode for the worse. You’re likely more skilled than that player, but that Lyra can just sit and click on you and win. Listen, blitz has it’s flaws for sure. I’m trying to point out what’s good about it.

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I know what you’re trying to do but the thing is I literally have something like that 95% of my blitz games. And I honestly do not have any talents at all (I have 1 talent but it’s misclick and hero I don’t use). Literally all talents I use are level 1 or no talent at all on some heroes. And despite that every single game I face people with level 10/15+ talents. It’s not even remotely fun. If there was other 5 minute mode I wouldn’t ever touch this.

13

Then why not invest some glory in those talents and give the game mode in it’s more true form a better shot?

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Because I hate talents. They aren’t fun, they take the fun away. And even then why would I waste my glory on that? I don’t want to pay to be able to compete. Why don’t I need to pay for ranked? Because it’s better designed. Blitz was supposed to be a fun mode. Adding ranked blitz was such a stupid mistake in my opinion.

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15

This could be debated regarding the extent or degree to which you’re paying. The $10 I’ve spent on this game went to my first battle pass and a few skins/heroes. All the glory I’ve spent on talents I accrued by simply playing the game and completing daily quests. I also notice a few of our members who have been playing the game have an excessive amount of glory. What else to spend it on in this game? You can’t use it for skins…

Overall, I get your point. For me personally, I’ve never viewed spending my glory on talents as spending/paying. Then again, and here’s where my arguments probably fall short and I’m willing to admit it: I don’t have the history, context, or experience of playing blitz without talents. This is what I inherited, so I may naturally be more OK with it.

16

When I came back to the game after a break I discovered blitz.

An absolutely facisnating idea, instant late game team fighting and objective rushing madness.

Then I realised that talents existed too and quickly realised that what seemed like a fun mode was never going to be.

I’m one of he unlucky people never to have experienced talentless blitz and it’s a damned shame as they do nothing but destroy it.

/2p

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I have over 100 000 glory. It’s not the problem. The problem is I don’t support this and I will never pay for it. Real or ingame money to me it doesn’t matter. They reduce the fun I have always. I’ve played on account with high talents and it’s still not fun. I’d rather not use my glory at all than spend on talents.

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18

Well, I certainly hope they implement classic blitz as they said they would as a rotating the two. I look forward to playing it and making some comparisons for myself.

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Classic blitz was I believe mentioned once when they announced One for All and the others.

It’s not been officially mentioned since and so I imagine was shelved.

Interestingly they mentioned the idea of 10 SAWs on the map at once in the original article / statement too; that never transpired either.

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I’m not sure whether this is related or not. I thought it’ll be a good way to express what I have in mind.

  1. What I think of Blitz with Talents.

I like it, but not with some specific Talents, be it on their own or in combination with other Talents.

Other than that, most Talents tend to fit what they should do, which is to:

  • Change how a hero plays.
  • Fix or remedy, even a little bit; the weaknesses of heroes.
  • Boost some aspects of the hero that improves the hero overall, be it to their stats passively or on their heroic perk and/or abilities.
  • Modify how the hero plays, particularly through modifications through how abilities worked.

That’s all I have to say for this I think.

  1. Why I think people think/feel that Talents are pay to win.

The aspect of pay to win comes simply from the fact that players can buy Talent Coins and Glory using ICE, which can be bought with real money; and that some Talents offer obscene amount of stats and advantage to the user.

This alone is the pillar that holds the argument pretty strongly.

Note:

  • Buying Talent Coins using Glory is an inefficient way (beyond buying just one coin) as the Talent market has a set limit of Coins in can give at any time and the Glory cost for buying them is absurd.
  • Not all Talents are born equal or remain strong. Once they get nerfed, they generally stay nerfed for a long time (or indefinitely).
  1. Some numbers related to Talents.

This section is just me rambling at this point. Feel free to skip it I say.

So, imagine that a player wants to max out one or all Talents for a new hero. What do you think are the costs for it?

Note: These are all using the most reasonable amount of money in my opinion and calculations. It does take some liberties such as rounding the numbers a bit and not counting duplicate rewards.

These are the costs for ICE using Australian Dollars (AUD) and the cost for Glory using ICE:

[ICE for AUD]:

  • 100 ICE: $ 1.49
  • 600 ICE: $ 7.49
  • 1300 ICE: $ 14.99
  • 2,640 ICE: $ 29.99
  • 6,900 ICE: $ 73.99
  • 14,400 ICE: $ 149.99

[Glory for ICE]:

  • 5,000 G: 300 ICE
  • 15,000 G: 2000 ICE
  • 50,000 G: 6000 ICE

Getting all the Talent Coins for a hero from zero using the guaranteed Talent Coin bundle:

To max out only the Rare Talent requires:

  • 2,262 Talent Coins.
  • Therefore, you will need to buy the Talent Coin bundle 67 times.
  • This equates to 80,400 ICE. (1200 x 67)
  • They also require 33,485 Glory.
  • Therefore, you will need to buy Glory from the Market.
  • This equates to 6,000 ICE which is the largest bundle of Glory (50,000) purchasable using ICE.
  • The grand total in terms of ICE is 86,400 ICE.
  • In AUD, this equates to around $900 dollars.

To max out only the Epic Talent requires:

  • 54 Talent Coins.
  • Therefore, you will need to buy the Talent Coin bundle 9 times.
  • This equates to 10,800 ICE. (1200 x 9)
  • They also require 38,900 Glory.
  • Therefore, you will need to buy Glory from the Market.
  • This equates to 6,000 ICE which is the largest bundle of Glory (50,000) purchasable using ICE.
  • The grand total in terms of ICE is 16,800 ICE.
  • In AUD, this equates to around $180 dollars.

To max out only the Legendary Talent requires:

  • 14 Talent Coins.
  • Therefore, you will need to buy the Talent Coin bundle 14 times.
  • This equates to 16,800. (1200 x 14)
  • They also require 45,000 Glory.
  • Therefore, you will need to buy Glory from the Market.
  • This equates to 6,000 ICE which is the largest bundle of Glory (50,000) purchasable using ICE.
  • The grand total in terms of ICE is 22,800 ICE.
  • In AUD, this equates to around $300 dollars.

To max out all the Talents for a hero requires:

  • You will need to buy the Talent Coin bundle 67 times.
  • This equates to 80,400 ICE. (1200 x 67)
  • They also require 117,385 Glory.
  • Therefore, you will need to buy Glory from the Market.
  • This equates to 14,300 ICE which is the largest bundle of Glory (50,000) purchasable using ICE.
  • The grand total in terms of ICE is 94,700 ICE.
  • In AUD, this equates to around $1,050 dollars.

This all is done without even considering the 900 ICE needed to get the new hero too.

  1. Extras.

Now, the duplicate reward for Talent Coins is Glory.

More specifically:

7 Glory for a Rare Talent Coin.
330 Glory for an Epic Talent Coin.
1,980 Glory for a Legendary Talent Coin.

This I think relates to the first Glory cost for buying a Talent Coin in the Talents Market:

  • Rare Talent Coin cost 20 Glory on the first purchase. 7 Glory is 35% of this.
  • Epic Talent Coin cost 1,000 Glory on the first purchase. 330 Glory is 33% of this.
  • Legendary Talent Coin cost 6,000 Glory on the first purchase. 1,980 is 33% of this.

In my opinion, the ICE and Glory a player can buy (no taking into account the discounts and bundles that pop up from time to time) increases in value the more you have to pay real money or ICE for them respectively.

Out of all the Talents, Epic Talents does cost the least amount of real world money to max out from zero.

This also makes sense when you consider that recently released of heroes have some of the best Epic Talents (bar the ones like Yates and Inara).

It’s a rather well veiled way to make some people pay money to have that great advantage from using said Epic Talent I say.

Break

Anyway, this is just my take on the matter. Hope you all liked reading my wall of text!

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