As If There Was Any Doubt; 3v3 (NA) Is Dead

Many of you know me as the mostly optimistic forumer in regards to VG and SEMC. With that said, IMO, ranekd 3v3 in NA is officially dead.

Here’s what did it for me:

  • 7+ minute queue times
  • Higher percentage of toxic behavior
  • Poor quality players

Recently, I wanted to play a ranked 3v3 match to prevent my rank from decaying. I’ve taken pride in having the “10”/Vainglorious title next for both 5v5 and 3v3 by my profile the past several seasons. What followed was incredibly long waits, folks throwing, and really, really poor quality of play. Worse than event the muddled talent pool and discrepency of our current 5v5 t10.

I played every role, every hero, and after losing 3 in a row (and dropping out of tier 10), I really focused in and did my best to remain positive, rotate, kite - you name it. A lot of players going off on their own to 1v2/3, really awkward builds, and as mentioned - rude chat/pings. I won a couple, but lost several more (and am now down to 2353). I was shocked. Unfortunately, it does seem SEMC has killed the mode.

The removal of 3v3 casual in addition to delegating the game mode’s spot somewhere discrete within the general UI, plus the lack of balancing geared toward 3v3, has left this game mode in a very depressed state. I don’t blame folks for the toxicity, honestly. I understand it. Especially if they’re old-timers. Their game was taken from them.

Ah well, I shall stick to 5v5 only moving forward. I like 5v5 - but it is a bittersweet feeling to become another one of the one-trick ponies (one mode ponies).


I barely play ranked 3v3… or the game at all. I’m a 3v3 player, but I can’t wait to find a match for 8 minutes and, if someone dodges (which happens several times in a row most cases) this gets longer. They destroyed 3v3, and as a result, I barely play the game. I won’t play 5v5 consistently (just played to reach VG so people couldn’t say “You are not VG in 5v5, only in 3v3, so you don’t know what you are talking about” to me).

5v5 never attract me, I don’t enjoy that mode and I doubt I would ever do.


It’s true death started the update they changed things in 3v3. It became unplayable at a certain level. Then, as I already mention in other threads, they start making changes based on the feedback from 5v5 player (who were asking SEMC to delete the mode) instead of the 3v3 player that were saying those changes were terrible. Short after they removed casual to try to unify the queues. That didn’t work for reasons I already explained in reddit. That update I left reddit because of pure anger towards every 5v5 player in reddit because it was them the responsible of killing the mode. I’m still angry, even more than when I felt lied and betrayed. They killed the game for me (now you understand our low participation currently -plus exams- in the CoW).

All that plus the terrible balance we’ve had in the mode, literally seeing the same 6 hero’s in every single match (no match I played changed more than 1 hero compared to previous matches), that is boring and tiring, specially when those heroes are completely busted and it’s the only thing you can use if you want to have any chance to do something. If you didn’t chose one of those heroes, it’s not like in other updates were you are in a disadvantage but you can still win or try to do something, now you can’t, the disadvantage is so big and 3v3 is so broken, that I’ve seen matches were one team spent the entire match in base (not being able to pass through the turret that closes base).

Now, this is going to sound terrible, but a part of me is actually enjoying the current bad state of the game as a revenge for that (risking the 3v3 player base it seems wasn’t a good idea), and worst part is that I don’t feel guilty for that (another part doesn’t want the game to die though).

I’ve been playing since update 1.1.3 (Ardan’s release), playing mainly 3v3, so you can imagine how angry I am, which sometimes makes me delete certain comments because I let my anger control me.


I think you and I were both in agreement that the changes (nerf to jungle monsters hp, kraken spawning at 12, etc) were going to change the mode - big time. The mode has never been the same.

I knew the mode was different. I knew it’s player base was likely thinner. What has really shocked me though is the very low quality of talent left amongst those I was matched up with. Made the game very frustrating.

It’s unfortunate, because I still find many elements of the Halcyon Fold more appealing that Sovereign’s Rise.


I decided to play 3v3 in every account I roamed for my team and lost the games , then in my last game I decided to jungle , the third guy refused to roam and went jungle , I did everything I could to win but I couldn’t , I dealt a lot of damage that even the enemy as a group use all their ults on me , I lost the match , in one of the games I roamed for a wp kestrel lane , he was basic attacking and not using traps , he wasn’t using his A to poke , it was a weird game seeing someone instalock kestrel and play her like that .

I think what is annoying is I need to roam or otherwise end up without a roam against duo or trio teammates , I don’t mind we all go carry but against another soloq q team .

Basically I wait 7+ minutes to find a match without someone decline or dodge , then who is going to roam question , but you know it’s a lose-lose situation anyway .

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3v3 ranked might as well not have any matchmaking system. In high tiers (I don’t even know if it’s still called “high” anymore), matchmaking takes way too long and even if a match is found, most of the time your teammates are going to be bad. They remove matchmaking system and it wouldn’t make a difference excluding having faster queue times.

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The quality of players dropping=/= lack of MM. 3v3 MM is extremely accurate, i cant recall having a ranked 3v3 match since 2018 where the difference between the highest rated player and the lowest in the match was higher than 1 sub tier. The problem is that those high elo players arent as good as in the past, but the MM is still there.

I was half-joking. I know MM is somewhat decent in matching players with their VST, I was referring to how some players in high tiers aren’t that good and don’t deserve that tier, as you have said. It’s the elo system that is the problem. Elo is inflated since you gain more points if you win and lose fewer points if you lost.

To maintain my elo in t10 I only need to win 3-5% of my games. I loose 1-2 elo point and I win 30-40 so I jus need to win 1 out of 30 matches to remain with the same elo, and that’s in t10.

I’m talking about elo gaining and loosing each time SEMC makes a reset, with the elo boost they give.

That’s not my experience at all. 4-6 pts for a loss, 4-6 for a win. Pretty neutral.

Also, @Guest_78 - I’ve definitely had a handful of matches as a t10 with teammates/opponents t8 gold silver (so 1.33-1.66 elo drop, not crazy, but it is a difference).

Overall, I do agree that MM is decent in 3v3 regarding VST and MMR compatability. As I, and now you have mentioned, quality isn’t the same, and most certainly nor is the quantity.

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Really? I guess it can happen, but I haven’t experienced that for a long time. It’s much more accurate than in 5v5.

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It’s not common, but as I mentioned, a “handful” is an accurate depiction. I’d say less than 20% of my matches, but enough where I certainly remember it.

Few hours ago I played in my accounts 3v3 , I got 1 match close tiers , the other 2 matches I got t5 player and the other one t6 player , I won the 2 matches with a low tier player and lost the match with the close tiers , I would be honest the low tiers tried to win and they did mistakes but not that big mistakes , the close tier match both my teammates couldn’t use their heroes and building them bad they both should drop to tier 5 and get replaced with the low tiers that are trying their best .

I’ve heard most Na high tier players have switched to Eu, apparently they would rather play on high ping then play on Na.


I’m considering it! Is they environment less selfish toxic?

Well, at least there are more players playing 3v3.

Nah its hella toxic, high elo in Eu is mostly teenagers with big egos but from what i’ve heard in NA its literally impossible to get a quality game whilst in Eu you still get those at peak times or when certain streamers are live. By quality game i mean 5 vg silvers vs 5 vg silvers, you still have a decent amount of players grinding in Eu cause of Maxman’s tournament but i guess the lack of competition killed the interest of most high tier players in Na to play the game.

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That’s me. Well, I wouldn’t say a 2450+ is “high” tier, but the difference in skill level from game to game, both with a VG bronze, can be so different. There’s no consistency here in NA for skill parity in 3v3. It’s like a box of chocolates. Never know what you’re going to get.

I am a returning player. My device at the time when they released 5v5 wouldn’t run VG. Last night I decided to try and install it…just to see and it worked!

Wow, it is so different! I played 3 matches and lost them all. I decided to practice with bots thinking maybe I am sorely out of practice. I put it on medium and found that relatively simple. I bumped it up to hard and found that relatively easy.

Granted, this isn’t any indication of human players, but I just wanted to at least warm up a bit before I dragged down my teammates. My favorite and most familiar hero is Celeste so I used her during all the matches.

I made mistakes but I quickly remembered a lot of things, like checking bushes, reading the map, staying close to the turret while waiting for my team to respawn and etc. I kept thinking maybe I was just really bad and causing my teams to lose…

Also, I thought I was going crazy not seeing 3v3 casual. Sad that it’s gone: I play for fun and I’d hate to cause competitive players to lose because I’m not on their level.

I did do the 3v3 talent mode and enjoyed that one a lot. I haven’t tried the 5v5 mode though. Kind of intimidated tbh.

Thank you for posting this as it clarified a lot of things for me.


Hi LadyPhoenix! I remember your name; good to see you again! :cheers_boba_t2:

I get being intimidated by 5v5 - it’s quite a bit different from 3v3, but can still be a lot of fun. Feel free to add me (ign: HipsterSkaarf) if you want a buddy for a casual match! :sunny_happy_1: