When do you think SEMC stops coming out with new VG heroes? What do you think a good limit is? Do you think they’ll stop at 50? Do they just keep going? What would you like to see?
My two cents: they already have too many and it feels like they come out quicker and quicker. I feel it dillutes the game a bit, and as someone joked in another thread, it can cause lack of creativity in naming abilities.
I’d like to see them continue to rework or tweak currently existing heroes and spend more time fixing performance and mechanic bugs. That’s a different topic entirely though.
I don’t think stopping new heroes is a good idea. They make meta more fun, they introduce new interactions between heroes and are overall the most noticeable new content. They are needed. As I’ve said before many times I do agree that we need reworks on old heroes. But the thing is when there’s no new hero we don’t get reworks. They aren’t correlated. If they specifically decide to not make new hero in a patch so they can work on older heroes that’s okay. I’m just speaking from experience.
That’s not exactly related but for me personally there’s 3 “phases” of heroes. I said personally because first 2 are actually only about me. 1st one I consider old heroes and that is heroes that were in the game before I joined. 2nd phase is heroes including the first one that was released after I joined and going ahead until the phase 3. So for me even though it’s been years already Heroes from Reim until now still kinda not feel OG. Anyway now more on point and why I’m saying this. For me phase 3 is heroes released in 5v5. I don’t know if it’s just me but every hero since Tony has that different feel. Their design seems different even though I can’t exactly explain why. But the other thing is those heroes all have been very cool, fun to play with great design. Haven’t been disappointed by any. They are what they should be - the standard. They are much better designed than some of the older heroes and that’s why I think we need some of the older heroes reworked. As I said though all new heroes are so good that they shouldn’t stop releasing them in my opinion. At least not without a good reason. If they want to take a patch or two to rework some older heroes sure but don’t stop the new heroes for no reason in my opinion.
I agree with a lot, but reworks are correlated to hero releases, source: the developers said so.
Working on reworks takes development time away from new heroes, which is why they do so infrequently. It does not matter if a hero released on the same specific patch as a rework, that time was spent testing the hero in stead of making a new one. If SEMC were to work on reworks for say, 3 heroes, it would probably result in them missing a hero release on a given patch down the line.
I personally don’t see a problem. It would open up more possibilities. Also much more interesting draft. Don’t PC MOBAs have like 150+? I never thought about it. I’ve thought about there being too few heroes but never too much. Why do you think it would be bad? I still feel like some positions/roles are kinda limited sometimes.
Yeah it makes sense. What I meant in my post was that from my experience when they do not release a hero they don’t do any reworks either. So I meant that not having new hero doesn’t mean they’d be working on problematic old heroes. I think the biggest problem is that they don’t wanna change the hero identity. Not gonna lie that’s not an easy one but on the other hand it’s not really nice to have heroes with kits so bad that they’re viable only because of broken numbers for 1 patch a year. I’d say take the risk.
I think they should take a break after a good number, say 50, and rework older heroes/improve them drastically for a few patches. I don’t think they can stop releasing new heroes, as that’s kinda a bread & butter thing, but I do think sometime soon, meaning in the next year or two, take a pause and bring some older heroes up to relevance properly. There are a lot of old heroes that could use fine tuning. The new ones have better mobility, better cc, better effects even if they aren’t cc in general, better cooldowns/animation times, etc. A lot of kits are built to work together better too, rather than just 2/3 abilities being useful for each build path and the like.
I don’t think VG has too many heroes. It’s nice to have an ever larger selection. I do however feel they don’t need to be releasing so many so quickly, and agree that maybe they should focus a bit more on game balance and QoL.
hi, it’s me, the guy who always cry for the diversities in hero types.
We do and don’t have too many heroes.
Do, because we have so many heroes that
are cute, beautiful, and human (some will bring up that statics that human heroes will be more used), and all have very fit body
have some what similar skill kits
Don’t, because like opposite of the above, you have to admit that we get bored really quick with the new heroes that VG recently release and keep going back to the OG ones. They only reason you use the new heroes is because they are OP, not because you love the skill kits. Am I assuming too much here?
People love Taka, or BF kits. We can see them cry because of nerfing these OG heroes.
What we need is well thought heroes with very clear play styles. Don’t matter if human or not. But have feel different when play compare to the rest.
I don’t play LoL, but Dota2 has great heroes design, looks and skill kits.
Ex: Bloodseeker, he is weak now, but you gotta love his play style so freaking much. That’s how you design a hero.
Example? Even the heroes that may have similar kits play very different to each other.
Yes and no. Yes I go back to older heroes, but that’s because I main lance and he is older (one of them, I play other older heroes, but that’s the most noticeable), no because I don’t get bored of the new heroes I like (kensei, Silvernail, Magnus), i can literally spam for days the same hero, doesn’t matter if they are new or not, as long as I like their kit I will play them. Some newer heroes bored me true (mainly because I don’t like their kit/hate them), but so does older ones.
Yes.
Hum… Silvernail? He is IMO one of the peak designs.
That’s blatantly a lie, you always complain about human heroes.
Um Skaarf, Glaive, Petal, Krul (yeah Krul is not human, he is unded) ?
Yes, he’s good, I did not say he was not unique
Two things about this, first, I always complain about human heroes, true. But what I meant here was that don’t matter if SEMC release a human or a monster next, it has to be well thought and unique. And if it is a human, I’m gonna just like * sigh * now. You don’t see me complaint about human heroes anymore lately, do you?
Sorry that I haven’t replied in a bit. My concern with too many heroes comes from usage rates. The game is 5v5. I feel, even now, the same 15-20 heroes are used. Yet there are 47. I’d rather have a game with 30 heroes, that are each well thought out, cool effects, cater to different playing styles, and a game where you never know who might get banned and who might get picked.
I also feel, and it’s just an opinion, I have no data to back it up, that SEMC is coming out with heroes just to come out with heroes or that it’s because it’s the norm they’ve set themselves for a new patch.
Why not announce a patch that greatly reworks matchmaking? Or a patch that adds some new items and fixes 3-4 bugs that have been commonly reported? I imagine that it takes quite a bit of work to create a new hero, even the ones we think are bland. This takes away from time that could be spent on other meaningful aspects of the game.
EDIT: to add, and to clarify, I don’t want VG to be 30 heroes. Clearly, that’s not possible. If I had to declare a vision statement for VG in regards to heroes it would be cap it at 50.
Skaarf is cute, which you also complained about, also, don’t dare call skaarf a monster! He is a baby dragon, and babys aren’t monsters . Glaive is a cat, petal no one uses her, krul is human.
Lately no, but I also don’t see you much lately XD
I believe the number of heroes directly impacts the ability to balance. As @hazeleyes mentioned before, there is a troubling belief that some of the devs push an agenda that is hard to keep and will publish incomplete products. When you rush out or create a large amount of heroes, some of which are broken, or aren’t strong enough, you end up with your Kenseis and pre-this-patch Reims to try and correct your error.
I believe it’s directly related. Too many heores = more imbalance. Just an opinion.
Problem isn’t too many heroes, problem is at what speed they came out, which I still don’t think it’s the problem. IMO the problem comes from too many meta shakes, poor balancing with random changes.
Disagree partly. I think they couldn’t figure out how to balance the Rise and took too long to make the necessary changes (zero jungle gold/xp split). The meta changes rarely (2.12-3.9) and VG is overly careful with reworking existing heroes. Even in top mobas with 100+ heroes, only the top 33-50% of the pool gets the most play. The problem with VG is the top 33-50% is 13-19 heroes.
Agree. More heroes are definitely needed. The hero balance since Nivmett left leaves much to be desired.
I believe I’ll have to agree to disagree with some of you. That’s the beauty of forums though! I just don’t see why more heroes is always better. It’s wasted space. Why do we care if other MOBAs have 100+? Why is it good that only 30 are used? I like balance. I like unpredictability.
It’s funny that when I recall my days playing a MOBA that had 24 heroes and only 12 to choose from per team, that I felt far more balance and then suspense over wondering who would be picked. With VG, which I love and keep playing, I can almost always predict who will be banned and who will be picked. If this is common with MOBAs these days with a plethora of heroes, I humbly suggest to the MOBA world to consider lessons from the original creators of the game’s genre. Sometimes, less is more.
Tbh, I agree with you to a large extent – I think the overall skill level among the player base was higher back when there were fewer heroes. At least for me, it was easier to learn the ins and outs of each hero when the roster was smaller.
That’s not to say the new heroes aren’t fun to play, and of course they keep the game fresh. But there’s a trade off for an ever increasing roster, I think.
I feel like the better meta becomes in general the better balancing would be. Before this patch the game was so weird because of jungle. Now we still don’t have clear defined meta but so far we actually have a jungler and 3 laners.
And that’s a state. For example last patch we had 3 viable bot. 2 viable assassins. Now basically all ADCs are viable. Almost all assassins are viable. I am not exactly sure about BF but even he could be considered kinda viable. So I don’t think balance got worse this patch. In mid all mages are viable. Malene was kinda bad and now she’s better and viable again. Overall we’re getting more balanced game. We just need to find the best spot for jungle in my opinion. Then balance would be much easier.
Also reworks on matchmaker and stuff like that has nothing to do with the team that balances so they’re not really related. Reworking heroes maybe but even then I doubt they’d rework any if there’s no new hero.
. Glaive is a cat, petal no one uses her, krul is human.