Where are the Fortress type of heros? Not necessarily Fortress

#1

Simple thread. Where are the heros that promote other things like diving, aoe effects (like phinn B)?

What im trying to get at is that all the new roams have barriers and healing and barriers. On my opinion, we dont have alot of heros like Phinn (AOE effects besides healing) and Fortress (more diving ). Maybe it’s because of the whole lore thing where Gythians love protecting with healing but i want to see a roam that promotes other things.

Im very vague but in short i want a totally unique hero again like churnwalker but not. Not unique compared to every other moba but compared to the roams we already have.

Feel free to disagree and say what u want instead. And not say “I disagree” and end the message <3

#2

i disagree

i believe the word you are looking for is initiator (for fortress)? i think we also need more people who do other things as well. it would help there be a more diverse hero roster. i want someone who fits the word disruptor

#3

Actually Flicker is an initiator

#4

Well due to the new items, all heals are now meta. Not a lot of room to experiment with that right now, or you will probably lose due to the enemy team healing a bunch.

#5

disruptor like Tony (ult)/Phinn?

#6

I believe that Grace and Tonyport are also initiators.

#7

So, the question in this thread is about heroes (support, generally) that can have AoE stat boosts, right? Fortress provides an AoE movement speed boost, Phinn provides AoE shield/armor… could there be another hero that effects some other stat? I think that’s an interesting question.

I wonder what other stats would work with an AoE trigger. Attack speed?

#8

Mmm nice idea. This kinda sounds like the Energizer from Starcraft 2, am I right @Xaldarian

#9

Like i said, i was vague on my description on a new roam.

I want a new roamer that brings a new unique trait to the table, it doesn’t necessarily have to be aoe effects of a different type from what we already have. Just something that doesn’t have a stun barrier or heal

#10

I’ll assume the capacitor plate works with fortresses heals? If so… mmm interesting new jungle hero.

#11

Cath is an iniator right?? Or shes a disruptor :thinking:

#12

Both
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#13

depends on how you play her. her ult is an initiate ability, her stun disrupts and her bubble turns her into a dangerous defender/bodyblocker.
cath is trying to do everything.
just as every hero can initiate with the team wide speed boost of the war treads.

to op, there is also lyra with an aoe speed boost.
but i think there are a lot of possible boosts semc can implement

  • att speed
  • wp/cp power
  • increase mx hp
  • reduce cooldowns
  • cc immunity/reduction
  • increase cc effects applied by your team
  • add extra effects to abilities and aa (like slow, root, or other)
  • keep someone from dying (essentially making them invulnerable for a short time, if they are about to die)
  • …
#14

O MM GGGG YESSSSS thats what im talking about, literally. i just want a fresh unique roamer that introduces something totally new

#15

well, if you look at the current hero roster, you see a lot of similar things.
like dashes in different variances.
something completly new is usually rare for several different reasons.

  • it costs a lot of money to program and test sth entirely new, compared to change and mash some already existing code. that was the reason why the taka le skin took so long to get released. the lines of code that turn him black on full stacks wasnt worth doing until it was needed for a new hero.
  • too much effects make the game really complicated really fast and it gets confusing to understand what is going on. (think of the projectiles for the treants heals they added. every ability needs sth like this.)
  • balancing may get hard, due to one or two heroes abusing the stuff (like saw or rona with adagios a until they put a limit to it)
  • it needs to be fun. as a roamer, you want to see the result of what you do. thats seen best with stuff that you do to the enemy, or with healthbars filling by your heal. other stuffs are harder to show visually.
  • we already have a few things that arent really used much. boost someone elses aa? adagio is the only one doing it. fears? go to baptiste. snare seems to be too op for the game, but its still an option as a single target ult.

what i would like to see are sth simlar to forts ult in the game as a perk. a support that spawns his underlings and uses them for extra effects on his abilities.

#16

TLDR: The balancing would be madness at this point.

One thing I’ve noticed Vainglory doesn’t have is a lot of reactionary silences, and having more heroes with aoe skills that are strategic would create situations where more of that is necessary, while also breaking the game for matches that don’t have multiple aoe support heroes.

What I mean by that is take reflex block; it’s one of the few reactionary skills that allows you to choose to directly influence an enemy’s ability AFTER they’ve performed it, because silencing before wouldn’t address more enemies having more opportunities to team buff/debuff, unless you had a global silence, which is brutal. Having more aoe abilities, especially boosts or weakens, etc., creates situations where we need more item abilities or hero abilities to shut these down AFTER they’ve been performed, because if more heroes have aoe support skills, it would also be unfair to let them all stack, but it would also be somewhat unintuitive to only let one boost from one hero apply to a team at a time. At the same time, it would ALSO be unintuitive to shut down all these aoe support abilities at one time, because enemy silencers would just wait your team to stack buffs, so the only strategic solution would be to have single hero shutdowns more available to pick and choose certain buffs to remove from a whole team, and that doesn’t even seem to be a mechanic that’s currently programmed into the game (that if a hero is silenced, their buffs are also removed from whoever they applied it on). Other problem with that is when whatever hero or item that can do that is going against an enemy team with only one aoe buff/debuff hero, where the frequency of shutdowns that you need against multiple heroes would be overbearing on one hero.

In short: Having more aoe support means having more ways to counter that support, but most of the dynamics of that are frustrating for strategic gameplay, especially when you put those counters against a single buffer/debuffer.

I wouldn’t be surprised if we got one or two support heroes that could perform multiple aoe buffs, but not a lot of them. That’s the only way I see it working out. Having multiple heroes with team buffs would just be gamebreaking in too many ways. It’s also why team buffs are usually so weak. It would also affect balancing team buffs against solo buffs, another area of complications.

#17

We need another Fortress. One that has a well designed kit, Solo Q friendly and that doesn’t alternate between broken or potato with number changes all the time.

#18

malene is distruptor in captain path

#19

Dunno how soloq friendly I just made this, probably not that great now that I think about but still worth throwing out there for fun

A hero idea

A character with speed boost that’s directional and it puts a path for allies that speeds them up when on it (what was bfs rose trail)

Another ability is a small aoe buff (adagios buff) that’s targeted like baptiste ordained but can also be put on allies and any ally in it including the target(if ally) get buffed while enemies inside it or targeted get weaker weakness(krul) built on them so their attacks do less the longer they’re in it

An Ult like Tony’s but grumpjaws charges, charge forward and damage and knockback opponents that are in your way, any hitting a wall get stunned(lance)

Sort of a mix mash of existing abilities but not too bad of an idea for another dive/aggressive support like fort

I too would like to see other aggressive or a buffer/debuffer hero or some support not focused around stuns, heals and barriers.
But something else that may be interesting that might not be too good of an idea to actually do is what if they made petal a support. Her seeds use to heal so what if that came back next to her explosive ult that heals allies close by and petal. If she were to be support tho I’d imagine trampoline would be changed to something else and of course damage/ratio reductions. Just fun thinking about it tho, a what if