What not to play in 5v5 ranked

Baron: so what you’re saying is he’s Varya but if she came online 10 minutes later, had worse damage, more unreliable and barely ever landing damage and was slower. You’re saying he can hold his own in lane but also that he’s bad early. He is not only bad even in lategame but he won’t even get there against decent mid laner. All mid laners are decent early and able to snowball. Varya is a bit weak but she actually does spike really hard and even she is able to win early sometimes. If a mid laner isn’t able to deal damage safely at any point of the game as you said it’s just bad no way around it.

Koshka: Sandiha is EU like me so I know. EU just doesn’t understand the hero. They’re afraid of good Koshka and can’t play her.

Petal: that’s the problem. She’s sustain fighter but when munions die so fast she can’t deal damage. For every one you spawn 3 die.

Rona: she’s not good late or mid game and never was and she wasn’t buffed. Late she gets destroyed by carries. I mean she’s probably not that terrible but she’s bad.

Taka: he just deals no damage. Unless it’s buffed (please don’t) if you don’t play WP don’t at all.

Joule: I agree she’s not THAT bad. I wouldn’t recommend her to anyone and I still consider her troll pick but there’s worse picks.

Skye: she needs too many things to happen to have a good game. Too unreliable in 5v5. Wouldn’t recommend her most of the time.

1 Like

Not played much recently but I’d agree with most of this, though I don’t think pipe is quite as bad as suggested (her stun is a bloody nuisance early game).

Ps - bring back Skye, she’s possible the most fun hero to play in VG but they’ve over nerfed her A.

1 Like

Saw needs to be in this list. Although I agree these heroes are quite bad Petal , Reim and Saw are just insta loss.

Hm no i think saw can work specially in solo q, bot lane offers him all the tools to snowball. He gets a 5 minutes bot lane tier 1 tower, a 6 minutes ghostwing and then rotates mid and applies pressure there. He’s not meta by any means but someone who plays bot properly can pull him off

Better damage, and he’s not bad in late game if you know what you’re doing. He’s also actually not that bad mid or early game either. He just can’t get kills. That said, I agree with everything else you said about Baron.

As for petal, as soon as one dies another should be taking it’s place, since you’re spamming seeds, and they don’t die that easily in team fights because that assumes both that the enemy has an aoe and that they want to aim it at the munions instead of you directly. Also try a DE on her if you’re having that much problems with them dying.

Rona’s not bad. We can agree to disagree though because if you don’t understand koshka rona isn’t that much better.

Taka definitely does damage.

Same with Skye.

I’ll just agree to disagree though.

Even if Varya doesn’t stutterstep and eats mortars she’d still outdamage Baron. If he doesn’t hit mortars he isn’t good and he never lands them, provided enemy knows what they’re doing.

Did you know Petal’s A has cool down. Additionally Celeste’s A that kills all 3 of them in 1 use has shorter cool down with CW or the same. Even on paper Petal can’t keep them up.

I do understand both Rona and especially Koshka as she’s my favorite jungler in 3v3. Rona is just not good lategame. If she does good she either is very ahead or your opposition is just bad.

CP Taka just doesn’t do damage. No matter how you see it. And I didn’t say Skye doesn’t do damage. I said her win conditions are too limited and very demanding.

The thing is you don’t really need Saw for that. Most bot laner and jg duos are strong enough for a turret take by the time it’s shields are down and considering the draw backs he brings I don’t know why anyone would pick him. If you want an earlygame comp why not go something like CP Kes jg and WP alpha bot.

Not to mention Saw can’t make any huge plays like any other fed bot laner unless enemies walk up to you and he’s pretty much useless against most mid laners too.

Yes i 100% agree what saw can do most bot laners can as well but i am just saying he’s noy as bad as people label because people who tend to play him in low tiers usually feed

Dude, by late game Baron can launch 2 mortars and bring most heroes down to 1/3rd health if built right, and the trick to him is overlapping your mortars to bomb in a predicted direction not or during abilities, not just randomly.

Petals A cooldown becomes 3 or 2 seconds with an Aftershock, perfect for procing it, and that’s not a long time to wait to make a new munion in a fight. And celeste shouldn’t be hitting your munions because they’ll be on her damaging her and she’ll usually be running away while they chase her, and by the time you get into battle with celeste, you should have a backup seed down already anyway.

CP Taka definitely does damage, and lots of it.

As I said Varya would outdamage Baron even if she intentionally eats the mortars. Now if you can’t dodge the most predictable skill shot in the game it would do damage. Problem is mages usually rely on good landing of abilities, Baron relies on enemy mistake. There is a reason he’s not played in higher tiers and in the history he’s been played for about 1 patch and wasn’t even that strong.

I don’t think AS Petal would do anything. She doesn’t have base damage and AS has low CP so even worse for her munions. 2 or 3 seconds CD is a bit higher than Celeste’s A don’t you think? If you think Petal would be making mages run away then I don’t think they know what they’re doing. Even in 3v3 she was counter picked with mages in jungle. Her kit is just terrible for 5v5 and not really functional in general. She’s either oppressive or weak. And she is definitely not the first now.

I don’t know when is the last time you played Taka but he was nerfed a few patches ago. CP Taka is absolutely terrible since then.

Yeah exactly this is why cp baron is a terrible pick he’s never gonna do damage unless the enemies walk into his mortars it doesn’t matter how good you are aiming you’re not gonna land them on someone who can dodge. That plus the fact that he has a terrible early/mid game and is way easier to lock down than wp since you don’t max B is the reason why absolutely no one plays him in tier 10 and above he’s just worthless. Anyone who believes otherwise is just delusional i am sorry

2 Likes

I max B and A on cp baron , why no one max his B ? , baron B is very important because it makes him hard to lockdown with the addition of clock work so you spam your abilities and get cooldown reduction .

Because you lower your basic attack range and your best damage skill for a safety skill…

2 Likes

well you can compare it to alpha , maxing ult is good but are you actually going to hit the enemy with it , long range A or less cooldown more damage ult for alpha? , i prefer the escape for baron than hard to hit ult or useless range !

On alpha you max your a and your ult. Never ur B. The b is there to provide you stacks that you can blow up with your A.

On CP Baron you level up your A be it’s your main damage source and your ult. It lets you have range so you can AA to reset your jump safely. The Ult damage is good to separate people as well because it does a lot of damage even if it clips the edge.

1 Like

Koshka? It so happens that I play mid koshka(not even talking about jungle where shes strong) once in a while and snowball and go like 15/x/y. Koshka isnt a hero you should randomly pick n expect to win with any comp. If there are opponents like vox, celeste, baron etc and you have an adagio/ardan provided opps dont have heroes like tony, cath etc, koshka can be picked n exploited.

this is the reason why top lane koshka excels. the best part is that her base damage excels so she can just buy pulse and some crystal bits to basically kill anyone. she is pretty useless at level 1 though unlike in 3v3 where she tends to be more dominant at that stage. maybe level a up first and buy two weapon blades LOL.

Max B then A is much better, CP and WP

On wp alpha is max a and b never the ult…

With alpha it’s chosing between damage. You sre forsaking a lot of damage on Baron…

cp baron is more of a piece of the puzzle in making an anti dive comp these days…