I won’t risk my elo for that, also, it’s not always one of the same tier that doesn’t deserve to be there, it’s often a lower rank player that idkw gets matches in a higher rank match, so risking my elo thanks to the incompetence of the MM? No way.
Again, I get what you’re saying, but it’s a bad attitude. If everyone had your approach to it, games would either never be played, ever, or it would be the same 10 heroes in every single match.
If the MM is horrible of course.
That means the game not balance, which again, it’s not my fault.
I shouldn’t have to pay for SEMC mistakes, and I won’t.
Not really. There will always be a best case scenario (the most finely balanced 10-hero set), but there are many many ways to win, based on both the openness of the game format and the skills of the individual players involved. But if you’re dictating that optimal set by dodging if it doesn’t occur, then you’re actually narrowing the community’s perception of what is best. Dodging actually makes the meta less interesting, as well as annoying all the players you were in queue with.
Again, I get that you don’t want to lose elo because you don’t like/understand someone’s else strategy. Dodging is good for you personally, but it’s bad for the game overall. If you need to have a clinical draft experience, get a team.
People complain about there being too many players in T10. But if 30% can only get there by dodging bad drafts or being gifted “get out of jail free” cards when their bad picks are dodged by others, then who’s really surprised? Smh.
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wait, what… the penalty of -25 is not for every time you dodge? This would explain why after the initial “no dodging” heaven in the announcement weeks, now it’s dodging left and right for all kind of the reasons (yes, even the "I didn’t get the exact hero I want).
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it should be -25 every single dodge. no matter the circumstance. No matter what. I’m bitterly dissapointed that the 25 elo drop isn’t being implemented for each dodge.
Heck if it was up to me, they could dodge forever and eventually end up with negative elo, forever stuck in Low priority queue.
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In update 2.8, known as the most balanced update you could use almost every hero, only 2-3 were considered weak and even those were viable.
As far as I’m concerned, they can be use anything that it’s not stupid (saw first pick, Celeste roam, things like that).
WP celeste is not a strategy, WP Koshka lane is not a strategy.
It shouldn’t be my job to make them go down at the cost of my elo. I never dodge, ever, but I don’t see it as bad too, which doesn’t mean I encourage it, because I won’t, but for me first the MM then the dodging problem.
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Nope first punishement is lpq then its elo penalty, you usually get away with 2 dodges before getting lpq on good karma and 3 for great karma. Lpq has basically the same duration as normal tier 10 queue time so its pretty pointeless and its why people dodge A LOT.
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The point is, by dodging, you’re actually contributing to bad matchmaking.
SEMC’s mistake is in not penalizing players in any significant way for dodging: the LPQ is stupid because it’s nothing more than a timer that delays entry into the regular queue and is easy to get out of.
VG should have something like AoV’s “credibility score” which is based on a number of factors, including AFKing, dodging, and negative reports. If your credibility score falls below a certain value, some modes become unavailable to you. It actually takes a while to recover enough points to reopen those modes.
I also think players dodging at higher tiers should be penalized more harshly than those at lower tiers.
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This is the greatest counter to every “it’s not that bad just deal with it” argument
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Because I don’t want to risk my elo thanks to a bad MM? So be it. I shouldn’t have to play with players two tiers lower than me in a ranked match.
Dodging should result in a loss of Elo as well, in my opinion.
If you see dodging as at all acceptable, you’re part of the problem with the crappy matchmaking and the poor player experience that is Vainglory at the present time.
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I wonder how high people must be to not accept or decline a match, but let the timer run and wait forever.
Also, get faster qs with Halcyon Fold 
I never dodge, I don’t agree with dodging, but I don’t see it AS BAD as you all, specially with the MM we have. IMO, the player shouldn’t pay for the devs mistakes, if they can’t make a good MM it’s not my fault, why should I be punished? I’m not playing with the same troll 5 times in a row, I’m not playing with a player that thinks that picking saw against mages is a good idea, I’m not playing with a player that it’s 2 tiers lower than the rest of the players in the match and has a 30 WR against his own tier, I’m not playing with someone that has no clue about draft in high elo, no, it’s the MM fault to put me with them, should I risk my elo? No, but again, I DONT DODGE NOR I THINK ITS ACCEPTABLE, I just think there are other priorities. If the player experience is bad it’s not my fault, just because I don’t find it a priority of the MM I’m not the responsible one dodging, I’m not the responsible of trolling, I’m not the responsable of every single problem this game has.
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But WHY would you wait 40 mins anyway?
I agree, as long as they use the same greediness to find the 10th player. It is super annoying when that 10th person is anyone random in queue and one team ends up with a tier 4. Or you end up being the one 4 tiers ahead of everyone else in the game.
Except no one’s saying that in this thread (at least, not yet)? The claim is that “dodging is an acceptable tactic for solo queuers” and the counters have not been “it’s not that bad just deal with it.” They’ve been, in various degrees, “no it’s not, because its [actually bad for matchmaking long-term]/[bad for community morale]/[bad for the meta]/[just plain rude and inconsiderate]”.
Are WP Celeste and Koshka bad strategies? Yes. The answer is not to dodge them though. Dodging just makes the situation worse by not letting those bad strategies get punished, either by the experience of losing with a 0/14/0 K/D/A or dropping elo.
I don’t know what the best answer is, but I do think dodging is a pretty blerghy thing to do. The best solution has to be a holistic one though, which is why it’s hard to find and implement. It has to come with punishments for dodging, obviously, but also anti-trolling measures, karma transparency measures, queue re-structuring (solo and party split in rank, for instance, in my ideal arrangement), and probably other things too.
Of course, but it should take that long, i mena, it’s just 1 more player, not 10. It used to be like that, idk why they changed it. Starting from 0 is one of the reasons dodging is that harmful to the player experience.
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My 40 min que was Halcyon Fold…
But until they do all this, you are asking th players to play with that WP Celeste or Koshka in lane, that’s why I’ve been saying that before really punishing dodging, they should fix the MM and all that, once they do that it’s okey for me to make hard punishments.