The lowest cost way SEMC could dramatically impact trolling would be a better score card and match results

You’re making a case based on exceptions you are cherry picking. Those in no way follow a standard trend.

I like the idea the more stats the better no matter the case. The whole picture needs to be painted.

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in your opinion
is that a very bad idea to show additional info such as damage to heroes/structure, etc?

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No. I’m not necessarily saying that. What I’m saying that KDA is already a good measure of combat performance, and that other metrics would generally reflect what KDA already conveys.

However, the performance metric which is sorely missing is objective damage.

Yeah, that’s what we’ve been saying :wink:

so you obviously have no objection if that other metric displayed, right?

No. I’m simply saying that it won’t make a difference.

If I had a choice, I’d only add objective damage.

On point like always.
However, I want a decent buff to all the roamers before anything else. Playing a roamed role in 5v5 is no fun.

Not always. There is no shortage of kill stealers. Most of the times the junglar builds TB only to steal the kills

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so we all agree that there’s no harm in showing that additional information

you have preference, ofc

i myself would like to have such as “critical save” and “healing done” info. and yes, objective dmg,

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I disagree completely.

The amount of good kda players in 5v5 like 6/4/7 who didn’t play all that well is insane.

Good kda can mean you played safely.

Good kda can also mean you were a coward that refused to engage and the metric that shows that is damage dealt.

Was going to post these exact same ideas not too long ago. Glad you did. Didn’t read all the comments yet but fully agreed: this game needs rewards for individual play, even if the team loses. Especially if you have massive damage done to enemy players, structures, jungle monsters, or massive healing to allies, barriers, etc. All these things should affect your rank & do something for you, even if it isn’t shown on the scoreboard.

And the big one is you shouldn’t lose as much rank because your teamates aren’t doing well, especially if you’re trying to play with rotations, etc. as intended.

Edit: After reading the comments, unless I’m missing something, not sure why they’re all about K/D/A. Damage is clearly an important factor in its own right and there are many roles that do damage but don’t usually close out the kill. Having objective performance as well as team performance would be a great addition for people who don’t even know the api sites exist.

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Playing safely is a good. The overwhelming problem right now is feeding, over extending, and abandoning position.

Sure make a sacrifice for an objective, or a captain making a sacrifice for a competent carry. That’s understandable, but taking fights in were you are out leveled and out numbered is silly.

let me put this into perspective.

At some point during the game person A sees person B make a bad play. Person A checks the scoreboard and sees person B is 1/4 KD and being that person A is 4/1 feels like person B sucks and is losing them the game.

Then not long later person B doesn’t respond to a ping from person A fast enough. Person A is “over this match. F this. No chance. Allies suck, gg,” asks for surrender.

In the scenario we have detailed stats, this goes differently. When he checks the score card with actual information, and sees that the other player is 1/4 but with a bit more hero damage than him, and WAY more against structures, he doesn’t just assume the other player sucks. He might even ask HOW?

He MIGHT even answer how, by realizing he’s playing Gwen who rakcs up kills like crazy, and the other hero Saw doesn’t have the finishing power.

These are hypotheicals, and I have no doubt your brain is already figuring out some hole in the example I’m giving, but seriously, there is a reason the API sites exist, why pro level players hire full time employees to crunch numbers, and why nearly everyone in this thread and on reddit agrees it would benefit the game, and potential to reduce toxicicty including Kraken on my reddit post.

If you don’t like the idea ok, but it seems like most everyone does.

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Making a 4vs4 a 3vs4 because you are afraid to die is feeding your allies to your enemies and guaranteeing their death.

Those people think they are playing safe but they are worthless cowards. And there are as many of them as overextending idiots.

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This is absolutely correct. Sometimes they don’t show up to what would have been a 4v3, instead leaving them 3v3 and they traded instead of forcing the enemy to likely lose all 3 or just not pick up those kills. KDA is so far from a complete picture I’m dumbfounded by this conversation.

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Thank you, dear sir.

I was afraid I was the only one seeing the issue which would explain the people I see in my games. :neutral_face:

I actually largely agree with you but there are holes on this side i feel I should still point out. :stuck_out_tongue:

Even Damage Dealt during a match is actually flawed. Ok, maybe not objective damage bar extreme cases, but just as we can have people with “good” KDA who are absolutely useless in team fights and/or never help others, damage can be misleading.

Specifically, you can do a lot of damage to the enemy team at the wrong time and get nothing done. Likewise, you can do relatively little damage and get a lot of work done. This is not 100% true obviously, and this is really more an exception than the rule (except on heroes like Krul who traditionally build lower damage). However, you can rack up a tone of damage as, say, CP Vox, if all you did was poke the enemy team in lane/while they take objectives, without actually killing anyone or stealing any objectives.

Or, what if you have say, Reim/Baptiste/Lance with a WP Baron/other hypercarry, and the “peel” hero keeps running off to attack the enemy? Completely neglecting their intended role of protecting their hypercarry? Is it the hypercarry’s fault if they get blown up by the enemy team while their peeler is off playing Rambo? Sometimes yes, but many many times, the problem actually lies with the player who “did” a lot of damage but did it are the wrong time and did the suboptimal play but “looks” like the hero of their team.

Ultimately, the best review of match performance is an unbiased viewer who knows what to watch for and has the time to analyze everything indepth. Sadly, that isn’t doable, so I would consider hero damage dealt (and taken?) + a list of other things to be the best realistic way to go. (Heroes like Krul can have damage mitigated/healed as well)

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I totally agree that the holes you’re pointing out are indeed holes. Like anything it would be far from perfect.

Doing insane DMg to tanks can pad damage for sure, but as always with this sort of thing getting closer to being perfect isn’t undone by not reaching it.

There are holes in every method. Therefore I am pleading for a fuller amount of info.

Ingame view of participation in fights, in combination with damage dealt, damage taken, and kda will give you a clearer picture than what we have now.

Just adding the Api data to the match results, will allow players to reflect on their performance and on others too.

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