Thanks, SEMC!

I have always been hard stuck at tier 4, but now with the revolutionary Tension Bow, I can finally screw over the elo of even the toughest of idiot tier 10 players that actually want to try and use comps that don’t want to abuse one specific item!!! Thanks, SEMC!!! The game’s never been easier for meta slaves!!! I never liked the although flawed, but diverse, overall balanced, and actually strategic meta we had before. I love this new meta with one item determining success and defeat with 0 counter building options because you nerfed the one thing that could potentially counter it HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! In fact, I never liked the fact that I got a Sorrowblade early on, so I really appreciate the changes to Tension Bow to allow it to scale, so I can have a little over 2 Sorrowblades without having to spend that much gold and use it to full potential even into the late game! I love it when I have 0 counters!!! This is the best meta in the game’s lifespan!!! Loving it so much right now!!! Who needs to actually get good at the game when you can let one item do it for you!!! (Seriously tho TB is the only problem. Most of the other changes are fine, but delete TB…please…even pre-buff TB would have been abused by Gwen due to the defense changes, but at least only certain heroes would abuse it…not every hero with a quick way to engage like Ardan…)

I have never once said this before, but with how the meta is right now, I actually don’t want to play (My only incentive is improving for competitive play rn). It only infuriates me due to the fact that being good does not matter anymore. The overall global changes did not make the game noob friendly. TB did. Just ONE item is ruining the game. Not even SM BP made me feel the way I feel right now. At least with that it was just a core to wp carries…not THE win condition. Games literally come down to who can abuse TB the best at this point. CP for the most part does not matter, skill is thrown out the window cause I had a match against a tea we were destroying, but lost cause their Krul and someone else got their Bows and insta killed everyone, and captains feel god awful cause support just…don’t feel impactful unless butt buddying with a side laner to rack up kills (Yeah remember when everyone was sick of the bot lane + jungle meta?) This is downright the WORST meta I have ever experienced since my 3 years of playing VG and we had some pretty bad ones (Cough cough Brokefeather before draft came out) SEMC should just revert TB, then nerf pre-buff TB and see how the meta shapes up. That ONE item is shaping the meta more than any game asset should ever do.


Should be in the Salt Mine section but ok. Alot of rants have been making it out of the mine which is confusing me tbh.

I agree with your points but at this point, I dont think SEMC can disappoint me further than what I feel rn


I chose not to put it in the salt mine cause I actually have some substance to my grievances even if my tone is extremely salty

EDIT: I added my first reply to the original post since it’s related


I understand that but Im just saying that the Vainglory discussion from what ive seen has alot more rants than usual which Im a little bit surprised about.

Just wanted to say that cuz If a new forumer joins and sees that most of the discussions are negative rants (even with substance) the people do have the right to call us salty :stuck_out_tongue:

But anyway Ill just go back to playing my AoV matches rn. Carry on and ill just lurk and heart what comments I agree with and such :tipping_hand_man:

Honestly VG’s meta can only get better from here. If SEMC somehow makes it worse I may just actually contemplate quitting till SEMC gets their act together cause that’s just how terrible this meta is to me rn (Especially as a captain main). Then again the current fix is as simple as nerfing TB back into oblivion and seeing how the meta goes, cause other than TB nothing else seems too glaring other than (Obviously) Inara and Anka still being very very strong. TB is just not giving the new changes a fair chance cause they legitimately seem decent…just TB ruined the entire meta worse than anything any hero or other item has done…cause at least you can ban HEROES

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Its like that saying of where you jump out of the pot and into the fire.

We managed to get out of the tank meta but it was replaced by WP burst meta.

Honestly the tank meta was way better…cause at least even then bursty comps like Fort dive comps were still viable (I mean Anka, Melon, and other bursty/non-tanky heroes were still very viable). Now it’s TB or bust. The only viable damage tanks rn are Grace and Joule…

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I’ve also noticed there have been an increasing number of rants outside of the Salt Mine. It makes sense, given that this forum encourages honest feedback (both positive and negative), while the game isn’t in the best place right now. However, the bitterly sarcastic tone of this particular thread definitely belongs in the Mine.


Alright understandable. I guess there should be a limit to just how salty you can get on the discussions (And I just realized that my title would actually be pretty misleading outside of the mine, so thanks for that)

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:heart:️ Best thing out of your post


Ill just go back to playing my AoV matches rn

Same, but I’m playing Mobile Legends instead. Matches with IRL friends has been a blast. Despite all the smack I’ve said about that game before, I’ll admit it’s fun (at least more fun for me than VG at the moment).

I just dunno with VG. I might give 3v3 a shot soon. I feel like athough the game is “”“bALaNcEd”"" for 5v5 (“balance” might be the wrong term here let’s be real) 3v3 is likely to NOT make me want to throw my phone out the window. :sweat:

Yah, I agree with this one belonging in the Mine of Salt.

The reason I’ve moved some others OUT of the Source of Sodium Chloride is that they’ve ended up sparking some fairly valuable discussions, and those would get lost to most people if left in the Pool of Saline.

The increase in salty posts lately is because – as you all know – the game is in a particularly bad place right now, with the meta having gone from bad to worse and with frustration among dedicated players at seemingly an all-time high.

We should try to keep excessively salty stuff out of the main discussion areas, though, as it is likely to give the impression that no one is having any fun playing VG right now.


The kids and I have been all-in on AoV for the past two months, and tbqh, it’s a breath of fresh air: it’s all the fun VG used to be – and Tencent are doing a great job keeping it fresh, with new modes, new progression/reward systems, new heroes, etc.

It hurts my heart to see what VG might have become had SEMC done things differently …


Not like this is too far from the truth. :smile:


On a side note when we all got involved in a little discussion about the “fun” factor, even after all that time, I still remember how much fun I had in 2.8 patch (the one before the HP changes in preparation for 5vs5, i.e. the last patch that was all about 3vs3).

Yeah, 3vs3, but unique map, mechanics, every hero was viable and all kind of compositions possible - nothing was too broken as item or hero and we all had just… fun. Pure fun, no que 10000h times, a lot less trolling and/or hate, cockiness and such, the UI was pleasant and most importantly - not something you need to look at for a long time at as you will be ingame!

The game was unique, fun, matches were around 16-20m mark on avrg, BUT the que time was nonexistent thus perfect length to play a game. All the details were polished - gameplay wise, map details wise, heroes created for 3vs3 and halcyon map.

If I compare directly the 2.8 patch with 3.8 patch counting all the + and - sides, I am sure as most of you, I find the 2.8 game just purely better even outside of the gameplay (less lootbox ripoffs, better rewards for ftp players, a lot bigger desire to spend money in the game, etc). Most importantly than all - fun and competitive gameplay with polished experience both gameplay wise and visuals wise, everything was crafted with love and it showed. Not investors pressure for money grabbing modes/decisions/additions.

5vs5 had a lot of potential if it was crafted with the same love, attention to details, unique spin off and complete rework of the needing it heroes/items to suit different players count and map layout. Sadly we are here now… :slight_smile:


I said a year ago that if SEMC wanted to bring out a 5v5 version of VG, it should have been released as a separate app, with heroes, items, etc. being reworked or replaced for what is essentially a completely new game. Instead, we got Frankenheroes and Frankenitems – “tuned” to work in both modes but which actually don’t work well in either. Meanwhile, the app became horrifically buggy as new code was grafted onto legacy code, a jarring new UI was implemented in excruciating fashion (seemingly random pieces replaced in each update … wtf???), and off-putting monetization schemes (chests, chests, and more chests!) appeared everywhere.

Most of the people I played with regularly in the 3v3 days gave 5v5 a try but disliked it. Within 3 months of the 5v5 release, nearly all of them were gone from the game entirely, as 3v3 wasn’t fun any more either. Even my own guild died.

I don’t think there’s any way to recapture what they lost. Though they now seem to have belatedly realized that ignoring the community was a bad idea, most of the community (by which I mean the die hard, enthusiastic players who actively supported the game outside the game) have moved on to other games. To survive, they need to cherish the players they have left and build reasons for new people to try Vainglory rather than AoV or ML or whatever. I don’t see it happening. The first isn’t in their DNA, and all of the changes they’ve talked about are just incremental tweaks to the existing game or long-overdue features that their competition has had from the outset.


Can’t have said it better myself.

Totally with you on that one and to add on top for the last part - having “full time” games like fortnite and PUBG nowdays too, doesn’t help. Yes, different genre, but one can play that much serious a lot of time consuming games. VG was one of the first serious games for mobile - as gameplay, as time needed to play it, as competitive scene, as tournaments. Instead of growing on top of it - they killed all while not only MOBAs, but battle royale games fight for the players attention.

When I remember how much SEMC laughed at AOV and MM @ December… yep and those games are 5 steps ahead while VG 5 steps backwards from that period of time (actually SEMC started backwards with the 2.9 that already started to ruin big time the 3vs3 and it’s normal as you described in details in your post).

As for the player base - all my guild and friends quit too. As you said it perfectly:

  1. everyone didn’t have as much fun @ 2.9 with the changes, but stick to it in hope for 5vs5
  2. 5vs5 was released and everyone did give it a go
  3. massive failure and underperform and this after SEMC hype it like no tomorrow
  4. most tried to get back to 3vs3, but 3vs3 was and is still ruined to the point of no return
  5. now add to that the que times, scandal MM, trolling, money grab “deals” and decisions, worse uninspired UI (read as copy cat and worse than the AOV UI for example), worse ftp part and so on. Spending more time que waiting than playing in a mobile game is $$$ - especially when the gameplay is nowhere near as fun as 2.8 and you will get 75% unbalanced match
  6. everyone quit the game and transferred to other games

gg wp no re


Honestly the previous meta was pretty good although we did have many complaints, but those were mainly technical complaints and the fact that we had the same meta for so long. This meta is just…god awful. Easily the worst in the game’s history. I only played 5 matches and I am already sick of it.

I hated the tank meta – I found it horribly boring, but perhaps that’s because just about all my mains are squishy DPS carries.

I think we all saw it coming with release of the patch notes. The only surprise is that it’s so much worse than predicted. :bacon_tears:


I actually enjoy this meta a lot more than the last one of full tanks and cc.