You change her kit like thay you might as well release a new hero
I always keep the core features and visual effects. Donāt worry.
Lorelai is a backline support any buff right now and sheāll skyrocket to a high winrate. Also a lot of her synergy picks got buffed ALOT so its expected I guess.
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Though Lorelai does need some love, she will be even more valuable this update despite giving her no buffs because of how many of her heroes that she pairs well with got buffed this update.
Even she is gaining a lot of popularity among pros and she has appeared in VGL and has had the highest winrate among all heroes(used 5 times, won 4).
That said it is mainly because of how good the pros are anyways so ā¦
Lorelai does need some love.
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Doesnāt she do good with frostburn? If so she would benefit from the buff
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Lorelai is one of the strongest roams, I donāt know why all the talk about buffing her. It is true she isnāt as popular as strong though but that doesnāt mean she is bad.
No. The only ability that fb affects is A. Even then Iām not sure if it actually slows all the time or just the initial hit.
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I think her okay-ish win rate has a lot to do with being rarely picked. Iām generally pretty good with Lorelai, but I just donāt play her if both teams arenāt virtually perfect for her. , and I never play her as a pure captain.
Her problem is that she gets countered way too hard for a captain. If she were played more her win rate would plummet, since sheād have a harder time avoiding bad matches.
If she didnāt have this then sheād be broken. You have captains that fit into certain comps and then you have captains that are super flexible.
An example of certain comp would be Churnwalker. He isnāt exactly the best example of this but he is the first one that comes to mind because if I am going to have him on my team I would want my team to be full of burst heroes and not ones that like long fights/consistent DPS like WP Vox. Churnwalker is all about that AoE to make the most use out of his chains.
Lorelai is an extreme version of this as she needs a comp that has 2 tanky yet offensive heroes and obviously 2 carries (any kind). That would be the preferred team composition for Lorelai. If Lorelai had instantaneous defenses similar to Lyraās B, yeah she would be reliable, but then sheād be just another Lyra.
Then you have captains on the other side of the spectrum being Catherine, Grace, Ardan etc., someone that will fit any comp no matter how bad or good it is.
The real problem with Lorelai after reading all these replies and taking into consideration her sudden boost in win rate would be: VG still needs more heroes. Because truly how many comps can you make that would let Lorelai be at her highest potential when considering enemy picks and bans? Yeah, there arenāt many comps, maybe only a couple that will suit her perfectly, but with this update and the balance changes she will see much more play considering WP Lance, WP Ozo, and CP Reim all are reliable bruisers/tanks/CCmonster. This problem will eventually fix itself as long as this game lives.
And thatās my 2 cents on Lorelai. Also, she needs a skin.
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Theyāre trying to make CW easier but less devastating, which should be applied to Lorelai too.
Nobody deserves to get countered this badly. She get countered by so many things like dashes (Kensei, Reza, Vox, Rona), high speed (Koshka, Skye), zoning and range (Celeste, Skaarf, Sam). She also has problem like energy issues, high cooldown early game, underwhelming CC early gameā¦ Like what sheās good at is peeling and zoning, but besides that she has so many downsides while Lyra has no obvious weaknesses but she can bring as much utility as Lorelai, maybe even more than her since heal is the best utility in the game
Lorelai in my opinion is one of the top 3 roamers. I think she comes after Lyra and Fortress. Lorelai is all about timing.
She is well balance and yes she is squishy but she can be annoying if played well. Always stay in backline and behind of your team!
Do not use pool that is obvious to enemies. Splash pool when enemies teams are in group, or you want to prevent them from running to certain direction. You fish food as choke point to prevent them from running away or prevent them attacking you team. Use fish food when the enemies are chunked together. And use fish food mostly on junglers like Glaive or Krul or carries like Reza, celeste and vox which buy your team some time to eliminate other enemies then you finish off vox or etc.
Use your ult on junglers who are entering into team fighting so they can get out safely with less damage and huge barrier.
CP Lorelai on the other hand is scary, I loved playing as CP lorelai in 5v5 and she can really counter lots of heroes when she on the pool + alternating current and Dragon Eye. Her attacks are greatly empowered. Lorelai is very similar to Lyra in late game. Both are scary in CP path
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Hybrid full hp captain with 2-3 CP items is strong too.
AC SF/SG CW/Superscout Fountain crucible wartreads.
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You arenāt supposed to engage in a 1v1 against any of them so I donāt see what is the problem.
If the enemies are wasting their dashes just to cross the damn pool then youāre controlling the tide of the battle. Dashes make a lot of other abilities useless too, like Graceās B.
Addressing high speed, some of the heroes in the game are literally centered around their speed. If Lorelai can shut that down then sheād literally be one of the strongest heroes in the game.
Zoning and range, this applies to basically every hero in the game, except ones that donāt have dashes on low cooldown. Ffs a good celeste can zone out a Vox of any kind.
You canāt have energy issues and high cooldown coming together be a bad thing. Unless if one skill completely depletes your energy bar I donāt see how its a bad thing. If she had low cooldown and did not suffer from energy issues she would be the most oppressive early game hero in the game, and that is not even considering the fact that she is already strong in the late game. Having a ton of AoE CC early game is not a healthy thing for a game either.
Lyra canāt even be a proper comparison at the moment because she isnāt even properly balanced. They call her a backline support but I donāt see why she is able to tele in and B and still survive. Balancing team needs to lower her base defenses and then Iāll truly consider her a backline support. But if this is the standard for a backline support, I dearly would like to request that Lorelai gets a buff in her base defenses and a slight decrease in her CP ratios for her abilities. Otherwise she is perfectly fine.
Lorelai is a really strong captain atm the moment, but she does have some really horrible weaknesses compared to other captain heroes who are solid all around.
Lorelai hates burst damage. So does Lyra, but at least she has her B and her Heal to make up for that. Lorelai canāt use her ult on herself for it is a waste of an ult with a 50 second cooldown. Because it IS a single target barrier they should honeslt give her old cooldown back of 30 seconds to make her better as a backline support.
Lorelai has such a huge delay in her B that it is not even funny. You have to have some sort of immaculate prediction to actually use it to help fleeing enemies for the delay just makes it miss entirely in the likes of Kensai and Koshka chasing your allies.
Lorelaiās hard CC is so bad, having a long cooldown with a teeny tiny radius is not a good combination, for it is almost impossible to land without empowerment on her B and youāll have to sacrifice the pool in doing so. for suck a shot stun duration and a long cooldown, they should alteast increase its radius slightly to make up for its delay and its long cooldown. Even a decent Lorelai will still miss it at least 50% of the time.
Lorelai is so difficult that picking her in draft is often more of a hinderance than an assetā¦
Only pro players or good Lorelai players who devote hours and hours of their time using her can use her to her full potential.
No wonder she is so unpopularā¦
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The TB nerf has improved her ability to Top lane. I think that is her ideal place right now. Drop FF and auto to clear lane quickly. Once she hits 6 and an AC she will be really tough to push down a turret against. She needs levels more than farm so the solo wave clears help. She also takes down turrets pretty quickly with her A and empowered basics. Just always fight standing in a pool. Her A counts as a pool for empowered damage.
I just had a match where I could 1v1 the enemiesā Glaive, Rona, or Varya just due to the Ult and only fighting in a pool. Her AC power spike is huge. I went AC, DE, Aegis, Eve (for mitigating Varya and Vox AOE). I basically dropped a pool, AA, Rona/Glaive dives, I use FF to quick stun draining the pool, I stand in the FF water, I Ult draining the FF, and then I Splash for empowered damage. Itās kind of how Skaarf would deal with Taka where he doesnāt run, but Goops and play around that.
PS: I just soloāed into SA with a Lorelai victory!!!
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And her FF has such pathetic range early for a 12s cooldown with tiny hitbox and short duration CC and huge delay and unreliable dmg (enemy just move out of that tiny lil circle) WHILE Lyraās A has long range, big AOE for zoning, deals noticeably good poke dmg and being instant and canāt not be missed if used to heal allies and after that she has her 2nd basic attack to harass with inescapable slow.
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Itās not about dashing to get across the pools; since Lorelai needs to stop to cast, most heroās can just walk through them and still catch her (until Lorelai has full tier 3 items anyway). The problem Lorelai has with any sort of hero that has a dash or speed boost is that since she is on he back line, they can force her into a quick 1-1 fight which she canāt win, then rejoin their team to beat Lorelaiās team in a 3-2 fight.
Lorelai is very powerful as long as no enemy thinks to attack her first, but she need rescuing more than any other captain. She is about as able to protect herself as Celeste is, which is fine for a mage but not for someone who is supposed to be protecting the team.
Think about every other captain; they all either have an escape, a control, or some type of scaling defense (or a combination of the three). Lorelai is not any more durable than any other mage with the same items, and since she has to stop longer than her pools would slow people down, she has no escape once she gets targeted.
This is why she has a niche as a hybrid top-laner. When here is a real captain on the team, there is someone who can peel for Lorelai when sheās in trouble, and who can shield/heal/body-block for her, which leaves her free to support the rest of the team. Sheās great as laner who also contributes some late-game utility.
Her vulnerability makes her a crappy captain though, because as soon as a hero with any type of movement engages her, her team loses her support.
Thatās why my suggested buff would just be to let her cast on e move (with the same cast time) and have the effects of her pools linger briefly (.5 sec to 1 sec) after heroās are out of the pool. Her weakness is that she canāt apply her zoning in defending herself (enemies really can just walk throug in the time it takes her to cast), so she should be more mobile while casting and her pools should have a small effect even if people get out of hem instantly. It would change nothing in the situations that favor her, but make her a bit more useful when an enemy is smart enough to attack her directly.
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Yeah, sheās godly as a top laner since enemies have very limited approaches in that position. Iām a little careful about which comps I pick her against; I pick her late, only if the enemy is not loaded up with heroās who can dive well (I might go against Glaive, but not Glaive and Taka). Since dashing melee heroās are usually banned in my bracket, I often take Lorelai if Iām 8th-10th pick.
She really just needs work as a captain. Sheās countered so hard in that role that he enemy team can basically beat her in the draft phase. Her weakness as captain makes her bad in 3-3 (since she canāt play half-damage/half-support without hurting most teams), and she is a very niche pick in 5-5.
The game still needs more good options for support, so it canāt really afford a captain with such glaring vulnerabilities.
You just want QoL changes lol that isnāt really much of a buff or anything, just reverting her to what sheās supposed to be, and yeah there are a lot of heroes that need QoL changes maybe not right now but definitely soon. So maybe sheāll get something regarding her pool cast time.
The splitting of her captain and Mage side into itemization HP/Crystal is what creates weaknesses on both sides.
Hybrid of both is currently the most suitable. Crucible Wartreads Shiversteel Slumbering Husk can all scale her slow etc while AC CW and DE are needed to provide damage.
This is what I keep saying. When SEMC tries to balance heroes for different paths it just ended up making them OP or UP. The reason Tony, Kensei, and Malene were all successful because they had one roles in mind and catered to that with nothing extra. Now yes Malene and Kensei are extremely OP but they were intented to be so thereās no excuses for it but overall the characters are great.
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