Normally u would buy echo on ardan lance grace etc. does the utility of echo warrant it a 3rd or 4th item buy instead of war treads or super scout
Imo, echo should be bought last.
After you get the core roam items like FoR, Cruci, Contrap/Scout 2000 thingy, Atlas and Wartreads.
I do like the idea of building echo as the 3rd/4th item on Lyra and ardan tho,mainly for their A abilities and ardans gauntlet. By buying echo,u could double the crazy amounts of healz/barriers and mobility. Imagine all 5 members receiving twice the speed boost from lyras sigil
I’m a fan of Echo. especially on heroes like Ardan and Grace it’s useful. I often buy it as a 4th item, or even a 3rd when Crucible or Atlas isn’t as necessary early. I usually start with Fountain, then go into whatever is most important in the situation (mostly Atlas or Crucible, sometimes SS2000/Contraption if there’s a Flicker or Taka or Kestrel) then War Treads 3rd, and then go off to the item best suited to the hero (which can be things like Echo, or CW, PS, SF, FB or NG), unless you really need another of the three you start with (AP, Crucible, SS2000/contraption).
Echo is a situational item on most supports, for instance on dive heavy enemy compositions I’ll look to buy a echo on lyra as my third tier 3/4th item. Her B is wonderful at locking down areas and can be up for use every 4/5 seconds with an echo helping to shield them from those dives.
On hero’s lik Grace and Ardan its useful for maximising their ults, however I tend to prefer building it later 4/5 item (if at all).
I don’t see it as a core item on any roam, it’s very situational to the match your playing. This isn’t to say it’s a bad item, when used at the right times is insanely powerful (love locking down a Taka wth multiple bulwarks then watching him be destroyed when he tried to run).
I dislike echo a lot I prefer CW because Echo offers too few stats for its price…
True, maybe perhaps semc could give echo 10% cool down reduction
I agree in principle, Like I’ve said I find it to be a situational item, for instance a 1600/1700 double heal from Grace can be OP when throw into a Krul whose tanking DMG for your team.
Exactly true but in a more drawn out teamfight CW will allow mote stuns barriers and heals instead of just a heal and then a very high cooldown on the item.
CW is the gift that keeps on giving. It never stops unlike all other utility items…
And that is not even mentioning the crystal power on top like a cherry…
Don’t disagree just think it would be nice Is some of the more unconventional items could be made to be more viable. As a roam you find choices rather limited…
Only on ardan as last item, IF nullwave gauntlet won’t work against enemies.
I buy it only on Lance & Grace for double stun & double heals, and sometimes Cath. I prefer more cool down on other captains since it’ll have more effect in drawn out fights.
I like it on Lance too. I know he’s not a top pick right now, but can still be fun… Getting a few enemies stunned up on a wall, and then stunned up again, and then rooted, is pretty huge. I realize now though that I usually only end up buying it when my team already has a lead, and we’re looking for teamfights to press our advantage.
If u use echo on abilities with short cooldowns(vanguard and sigil) and not the ult with the long cooldown, your echo will have a shorter cooldown. Your double As in quick succession would be up quite frequently(something like 13 seconds) and it greatly helps in teamfights.
of course, CW is the winner in drawn out teamfights.
However, echo would offer an alternate 'instant effect’
this would be gd in some situations but overall CW should be better.
as glowarm said, would be nice if we saw echo instead of the standard roam items on a roam, hopes this instant effect gives the roam some incentive to buy echo
I use Echo on Lyra because she already has low cooldown, no need for CW (her sigil has around 5s cooldown with normal build + CP infusion).
With Lorelai I’d go Echo if there’s 1 teammate who often commits and takes dmg constantly in team fights, CW if teammates are mostly backliners or assassins who weave in and out.
Dont know about others because I only enjoy backline supports
I has no hp nor cooldown… It offers no decent passive stats and is expensive.
Even if you echo a Vanguard or some other low cd skill Echo will be on cd and useless in the meantime. Echo is useful on single or double damage skill heroes. On full damage heroes like Ardan and Lance Clockwork is superior because every skill in the chain will lower the cd of the other skills creating a weave instead of a single chain of skills.
Unlike echo which just doubles one skill and offers no additional stats…