Everyone's favourite bunny 🐰 Gwen Guide

mq003at · February 16, 2018, 7:07pm

Not good anymore. Double Ssw is good before they got nerfed in 2.12, I used to build 3 of them XD (well, A has 3 secs CD, why not abuse?). Right now they are expensive and just give her crappy stats, not worth.

I prefer getting TB first, then Ssw, some defense items, BP, upgrade the defense item, finish the boots (can be Halcyon Boots, War Tread, or Journey Boots), then Sorrowblade.

And now, depend on the Situation, I will change it a little bit.

BoE as first item if I play against Saw. But if my jungler is a hero who can gank fast (i.e Rona, Samuel, etc.) still go for basic starting items and spam I need help!
If they are more powerful than us and start to snowball, I will get defense item sooner.
If our team is too powerful, I will buy TM right after finishing BP, and I HAVE TO MAKE SURE WE WILL FINISH THE GAME BEFORE 17:00 (yeah, its low price really help in snowballing, but please don’t try it if you are not familiar with)

Greedy is bad.

P.s: please say no to Tornado Trigger or Poison Shiv

Xaldarian · February 16, 2018, 7:17pm

And if you want sustain and damage so 1 defense would tb Ssw BP SM SH WT be worthwhile?

mq003at · February 16, 2018, 7:25pm

No Serpent Mask. Your damage is burst damage and you won’t frequently auto attack as other heroes so that item would be a waste. (Imagine you burstshot an enemy and you received 100 HP for that, but enemy deals 200 damage each time they hit you, and because you are the carry so after that shot you have to run like a rabbit and can’t shoot much. Other items are better.)
About Bone Husk, I don’t know. As for me, that item is pretty weak since it only provides health from burst damage. If I need that I would prefer Aegis because the lower your health is, the more shield it generates. Besides, it even block CC for 0.5s so basicly you have 2 tools to CC-dodge. However, BH is pretty good when dealing against Ringo, Baron (WP auto attacker), so it depends on your playstyle. But remember, it can only save you once!
Mostly I used War Tread if enemy has mobility assassin, for example: Koshka or Fortress. That is the time i run away and use War Tread to buff movement speed for my captain and jungler so they would form a wall between me and the rest of enemy team and help me. By doing like that, enemy captain and carry can’t do a thing while 3 people of my team can focus on 1 target.

But Gwen as a suistain hero? Meh, she is not Idris.

Moose · February 16, 2018, 7:30pm

Never SM.

But still on the SSw, do you prefer SB or SSw? @mq003at I’ve personally not touched it since nerf in 2.12 - I get the difference but situationally? Or is it just preference on play style

Xaldarian · February 16, 2018, 7:51pm

I am a heavy skill user so Ssw

mq003at · February 16, 2018, 8:20pm

It’s not preference, it is nearly a core item for Gwen now. Since it decrease the A’s CD and mana regen, it gives you more opportunity to poke in lane without worring about you mana. (for example, if you go for SB, its 100% obvious that you have to wait around 25-30s to maintain your mana so that your combo still avaible. However, it is not true when you give Gwen a SSw since you can use A whenever it is off CD and you can regen the mana by safe farming) The other use of that is it allows you to use skills more frequently, especially A and ultimate. Moreover, you can now use B twice, even three times in a long combat if needed.

In the conclusion, it is because the mobility aspect it gives you, not playstyle preference.

Bayou · February 16, 2018, 9:36pm

SSW also works so well because all of her skill damage is WP damage. So when you hit 4-5 enemies with her A, you build BP stacks. That lower cooldown and regen lets her use her A more often to stack BP. People forget about the passive, but it’s so good for Gwen with her 5 second cooldown on her A.

Xaldarian · February 16, 2018, 9:39pm

This is listed in my OP lol but yeah true.

Trex97 · February 17, 2018, 5:05am

Is it just me who feels that Gwen has no meele counters now and only saw and Ringo can contest with her? Wp idris used to counter her but right now he does nothing against her due to the increased range and buffs meaning I can’t get my barrier and she melts me before I get close to her

RedKestrel · February 17, 2018, 5:19am

SSW is legit useless on Gwen compared to SB

Less Raw WP
Less A Slow Strength
Passive is wasted on Gwen as she isn’t an attack speed focused carry
Less Burst Damage
Extra cooldown doesn’t help it’s cons even slightly

TB/SB/Double TM

Or

SB/Double TM/Blazing Salvo flex into TT/BP/BS depending on enemy items

Trust me been playing Gwen as my fav WP carry since her release, these are the most optimal in her current state.

Xaldarian · February 17, 2018, 6:40am

You say trust me. But say Ssw is useless. In my experience it is really good on her. Then @mq003at says the same and he is VG bronze.

When you state that it is rubbish what are your credentials? Show us a game and let’s discuss.

RedKestrel · February 17, 2018, 7:08am

Well being in VG silver countless times should validate my opinion, check my VGPro or whatever, but then again rank barely matters atm. Hell I dropped down to POA just to rank with my friends.

Do the math, SB beats SSW any day of the week on Gwen, same with updated Ringo. Just don’t use your abilties when they’re unnecessary and you won’t need to rely on SSWs medicore energy and cd buffs.

RedKestrel · February 17, 2018, 7:11am

Here’s this if you don’t believe me, but like I said, rank doesn’t really matter. Also please don’t use 5v5 to justify your claims, 5v5 is horribly unbalanced in terms of MM atm, anyone can win with anything as long as the enemy team doesn’t know what they’re doing.

Xaldarian · February 17, 2018, 7:16am

Okay I’ll take your word for it that raw damage wise SB is better even taking skill use into consideration.
What do you think of BP as a core item for damage stacks?

Also I read that gwens perk can’t crit making TM less of a good choice what are your thoughts on this?

Xaldarian · February 17, 2018, 7:20am

SH cd is lower than Aegis cd. Where did you get that aegis grants a larger barrier? You mean when your hp is really low you can’t use SHs effect because there is no hp to fortify.

I prefer SH because when people dive you your chances of survival are far greater. Also in an extended team fight it can trigger twice unlike aegis.

RedKestrel · February 17, 2018, 7:26am

Uhh I believe her Perk stacks with crit and TB proc, which is what makes her so much more of an on-hit carry rather than an attack speed carry. Her perk just makes it so her AA is increased by said amount, then crit chance and crit damage is added + TB proc if avaliable. If you wanna build attack speed items I suggest not going the TB route, and instead going a SB crit build with BP/TT/BS 4th item. It’s better to go this route when your enemies have barriers that block the TB damage, you know they’ll go three item, and/or they have a tankier/sustain focused team with 2+ members boasting heavy sustain.

mq003at · February 17, 2018, 12:45pm

1/ Her perk deals physical damage, so it still has the armor pierce from TB.
However, the crit won’t proc her perk! I just tested it recently in practice. Gwen level 1 buying Sorrowblade + Minion Foots (give 5% crit damage) and trying to attack the treant.

When basic attack without crit: 117.
Perk + crit: 228.
Perk not crit: 164. => Perk damage = 47.

So in here, I have 155% crit damage, so Gwen’s damage crit must be: 115% x 117 + 47 x 115% = 254.2
However, we only deal 228, why?
Because the perk is not critted. Therefore, 115% x 117 + 47 = 228.35.

2/ I am a fan of Gwen-says-no-to-Tornado-Trigger. She is a burst carry, not a carry focus on DPS. If you want to play a DPS carry, go and pick Ringo. Ofc, she has to hit and run, but it is pretty much weaker. ( I am even think about instead of let her basic attack freely the Kraken, wait until she has perk then attack will be more powerful)

3/ I am not fighting with you guys about choosing SB over SSw. I already stated my reason why I choose SSw, it gives her more space to farm and easier when going into combat. Sure, the SB gives you 50 damage more, ofc it will buff a lot of her damage output, but you have to remind that her skill is also worth to care about. If you want to play all-in, fine, just rush a SB, but for me I will keep buying SSw and SB as my 4th damage item since I use skills a lot while farming and I initiating in combat using ultimate.

If Gwen has 1 SSw, how much CD she has on her skill?

A: from 5s → 4.1s.
B: from 12s → 9s (at lv5).
U: from 60s → 45s (at lv2).

Compare the skills’s damage. Attacking Kraken with (A - Ultimate)

With SSw: 82 - 117
With SB: 93 - 133

So, if we think about the damage Gwen’s skill does if she uses them everytime it is off CD, how much damage she deals?
Because Gwen’s A has 4-5 seconds CD (SSw-SB value), we will multiply it with (5-4)

With SSw, A deals: 410 damage in 20 seconds.
With SB: A deals 372 damage in 20 seconds.

In the conclusion: you will have more damage in Perk if buying SB, however, you will have to use perks and basic attack a lot!

4/ Talking about rank is useless. Want to know my true skills? I am now Silver II in League of Legends, can’t climb higher.

5/ I mostly use her for CP Path for… fun! And play dirty also! So… fly away

Xaldarian · February 17, 2018, 1:00pm

Very insightful post thanks for adding all that info too. 15 sec of Ult cd is a lot.

mq003at · February 17, 2018, 1:06pm

And that’s lv2 ultimate (I mostly Ultimate but in 5v5 i prefer B since it gives her more space).

Just update the 3rd section, maybe you wanna check!

Moose · February 17, 2018, 5:40pm

This is exactly how I have been playing her, thanks for the validation However why TT? I’m personally not a huge fan, but I assume it’s only a flex for particular situations.