I’d give up, you win convince them that Ardan is top meta in tier 10. I’m not saying Catherine is bad, she’s a great top lane hero, but as a roam? Nahhhh not in tiers 9/10, I just don’t see her being played and for good reason.
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I prefer grace over ardan, but he is more “noob” team mates friendly. Grace needs some coordination and team play to make her work great. Otherwise her shielding is wasted and leaved 1vsfew.
lets be real here , people who willing to roam are few compared to who wants to lane and jungle
thats what makes ardan top roam , is not if he is op , ardan has his strength and weakness , players mentality made him top.
@Glowarm nobody said pick cath against ardan instead of lyra , the discussion was why picking ardan against lyra if cath is open and enemy team has burst damage , like @Bobmax thinks lyra good against cath , cath was always good into lyra but people pick other picks !
its like when people pick anything against vox right now , few people pick ringo , ringo was always good against vox but people ignored picking him for a long time , now people pick him against vox but not all the time some of them prefer gwen.
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I don’t know where you play but even in soloq I rarely roam myself. Certainly not lane is very contested but roam mains aren’t few anymore. What made Ardan good is his vanguard not mentality.
Quote me where I said Catherine is good or bad into Lyra. I said Lyra is lane bully, Catch is being lane bullied. There is no way Catherine would do better in lane than Lyra unless Lyra misses a limb or 2 or maybe eye sight. Ardan is at least 10 times better in lane than Cath. If you lost with him to Lyra and Baron you most definitely would have with Cath.
What skill tier do you play in because this makes a huge difference. I know people who hate Ardan, think he’s boring but I don’t know anyone who claims he’s not top roamer let alone bad
Roam catherine always in the middle of the fight.
Damage taken seems really low but that’s because of my perma bubble. Fought against two Vainglorious players.
Cath>Ardan in this match
This match, but in general Ardan>Catherine.
My 5v5 ranked cath I only play her as captain. Certainly not a fluke or just one match.
In 3v3 Ardan>Cath and while Ardan works very well with dive comps (his specialty) but cath can be a lot better in several comps. That’s why I dislike an Ardan first pick which was the original topic haha
Also Ardan has a 50.41% winrate with a 56% pickrate.
Cath has a 52.93% winrate with a 37% pickrate.
So yeah Ardan on paper and in my games looks to be overvalued…
Source: https://vgpro.gg/heroes
You said it, in YOUR games, right now ardan is top tier, good at first pick as he doesn’t reveal any information about your como (and also doesn’t restrict it) and has no direct counter.
If he is so good why then does he have such a low winrate with a high pickrate?
And any stun chain combo is very strong. Glaive Tony Joule Celeste Skye and several others work very well with cath, not to mention heroes like Vox where they can chain their silences to infinity and beyond…
Low WR? He has ~50%. That shows he is good in most situations (maybe not the best), which means he is a good first pick, far better that Catherine or any other.
Not backed up by the data… He has a super high pickrate which isn’t justified by his winrate. And no low ranked matches don’t count in this data…
I never said low ranked matches were taken into account…
So according to this data Cath has only 2% higher win rate while she’s a counter pick. This is not saying she’s better than Ardan. If she had over 50% pick rate like him her win rate would be much lower.
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So you would say Ardan is a generalist and cath is a specific counter?
If so it’d even more stupid to pick a generalistic captain as first pick because the enemy can draft into a team that requires a counterpick like cath…
Let’s say for example Kestrel. Cath is better than Ardan into her specifically but Ardan is not bad either. Also it’s a single pick in the enemy team. And also Ardan always has his protection which is good with and against anyone.
But it gives 0 info about your comp, with that logic you wouldn’t pick anything just in case you need to counter. He is good as a 1 pick for that reason, picking everything else would lead you to being counter picked or giving information about your comp to the enemy, which is also not good.